Do you lock off?

[shanky887614]

I'm with Tony on this one, it's a different world working in the industrial sector. I have worked on many varied things from huge crushers and tyre shredders to furnaces, foundries and the list goes on.
It doesn't bear thinking about what could go wrong if there wasn't an extremely stringent isolation procedure in place, I have unfortunately witnessed a couple of serious injuries due to lack of safe isolation and I don't want to see another one as long as I live.

i dont think anyone is disputing that, usually in a shutdown procedure its good practise to turn off upstream and test at local isolater before locking off.

This proves two things

1. the legend is correct
2. there is not multiple supplies going ti machine.

unless you are familiar with these heavy machines you shouldn't be working alone on them for safety reasons.

how do you know there isnt a supply going into a different part of the machine that isnt interlocked?

it is not always possible to see the cables entering the machine and depending on what it is that doesn't always help if everything is wired in swa

 

[Guest125]

i dont think anyone is disputing that, usually in a shutdown procedure its good practise to turn off upstream and test at local isolater before locking off.

This proves two things

1. the legend is correct
2. there is not multiple supplies going ti machine.

unless you are familiar with these heavy machines you shouldn't be working alone on them for safety reasons.

how do you know there isnt a supply going into a different part of the machine that isnt interlocked?

it is not always possible to see the cables entering the machine and depending on what it is that doesn't always help if everything is wired in swa

Test before touch. Always. This way if anything has been missed during the locking off procedure then you would be aware. Even if locked off I would still test before touch as I went along.

 

[tazz]

Don`t go using your multimeter on those live rails now UKesrail....

 

[Guest125]

Don`t go using your multimeter on those live rails now UKesrail....

Nope. I am not allowed to use that tool. They are called conductor rails these days. You have reminded me that when a DCCR is isolated ALL engineers working within the area have to witness the test being carried out. We are not allowed to take the testers word for it. It MUST be witnessed. Good practice to use when testing after locking off also.

 

[andyelectric]

In the RN we had a tag out system incorporating electrical, hydraulic, moving machinery and a shiphaz system governing the likes of radiation emissions.

For electrical isolation officially the tagout system was always used. However with Weapon Engineers working mostly in their own compartments an unofficial 'risk based' isolation procedure was used and it was rare to find WE tagouts for short term work(fuses in the pocket was more likely) . Long term isolations were a different matter.

 

[Guest125]

In the RN we had a tag out system incorporating electrical, hydraulic, moving machinery and a shiphaz system governing the likes of radiation emissions.

For electrical isolation officially the tagout system was always used. However with Weapon Engineers working mostly in their own compartments an unofficial 'risk based' isolation procedure was used and it was rare to find WE tagouts for short term work(fuses in the pocket was more likely) . Long term isolations were a different matter.

Real world...

It always makes me smile of risk assessments carried out on war ships.

 

[andyelectric]

Real world...

It always makes me smile of risk assessments carried out on war ships.

Health and Safety used to be given a nod and a wink, but now it is heavily applied as crown immunity(I may have the wrong wording there) giving exemption from prosecution was removed.

In certain areas it definitely still gets ignored, the fact that it will invariably be the MOD and not the individual who gets prosecuted helps this.

Certain things, like 2 man lifts for gunnery rounds, scaffolding for reaching high areas are so impractical on a ship.

 

[Pete999]

Real world...

It always makes me smile of risk assessments carried out on war ships.

Why is that then? there are a lot more risky bits of kit on one of HM Ships than in an electrical installation, don't one of those blowing up do we?

 

[Guest125]

Why is that then? there are a lot more risky bits of kit on one of HM Ships than in an electrical installation, don't one of those blowing up do we?

I said that tongue in cheek - RA for working on electrical work and missiles coming out the other end... lol.

 

[andyelectric]

Why is that then? there are a lot more risky bits of kit on one of HM Ships than in an electrical installation, don't one of those blowing up do we?

You are correct Pete. I'd take an electrical shock over being irradiated by a pointing radar anyday.

The shiphaz procedure I mentioned is extremely robust, and for outside contractors permits to work need to be signed by various personnel. The tagout system when properly used is also a very transparent and robust system.

Prior to health and safety, there were always safe working practices onboard, it's just more formalised now, the main example being written risk assessments for just about every conceivable job onboard.

 

[Tidy Max]

I just wear marigolds and wellies. Time is money gents.

and i literally mean JUST marigolds and wellies.

Lock out with your c#ck out!

 

[pennychew]

and i literally mean JUST marigolds and wellies.

Lock out with your c#ck out!

Just as well you lock out and don't lock off!

 

[thekingiam]

Just cut through the cables your working on at the consumer unit no need to turn off consumer unit and everyone's happy simples

 

[GB.Kayak]

Health and Safety used to be given a nod and a wink, but now it is heavily applied as crown immunity(I may have the wrong wording there) giving exemption from prosecution was removed.

In certain areas it definitely still gets ignored, the fact that it will invariably be the MOD and not the individual who gets prosecuted helps this.

Certain things, like 2 man lifts for gunnery rounds, scaffolding for reaching high areas are so impractical on a ship.

'Crown immunity' ... correct, not sure that it has been removed from all areas of MOD activity though.

In the world of military aviation there are similar concerns over tool control. After doing the right job, it is part of doing the right job right; loose articles, either left in the wrong place by tradespeople or lost by aircrew or passengers have lead to fatal incidents. The hassle and 'lost' operating and maintainer hours as a result of such an incident are significant! To that end all tools, should be 'tagged out' and back in however great the pressure of work or aircrew shouting for their 'cab' before an aircrafts' maintenance paperwork is 'coordinated' and the aircraft is allowed to fly! The real difficulties arrise with 'snags' that occur on 'crew-in' when there are no 'hot' spares.

 

[markc123]

Very rare. Either tape or keep the switch off tell the customer not to switch on or shout yolo and change whatever live ... once changed a CU live, stuck the meter tails in 2 massive chock blocks.

Some will read that and think joker, some will read that and think this nob is telling the truth ... all vote now!

 

[Guest125]

Very rare. Either tape or keep the switch off tell the customer not to switch on or shout yolo and change whatever live ... once changed a CU live, stuck the meter tails in 2 massive chock blocks.

Some will read that and think joker, some will read that and think this nob is telling the truth ... all vote now!

I hear you. Probably best putting this comment in the pub though away from eyes that may take what you said as good advice.

Is this a do as I say comment and not what I do???

 

[ruston]

Very rare. Either tape or keep the switch off tell the customer not to switch on or shout yolo and change whatever live ... once changed a CU live, stuck the meter tails in 2 massive chock blocks.

Some will read that and think joker, some will read that and think this nob is telling the truth ... all vote now!

:49:Telling the truth because you typed that with your thumbs.

 

[Pete999]

You are correct Pete. I'd take an electrical shock over being irradiated by a pointing radar anyday.

The shiphaz procedure I mentioned is extremely robust, and for outside contractors permits to work need to be signed by various personnel. The tagout system when properly used is also a very transparent and robust system.

Prior to health and safety, there were always safe working practices onboard, it's just more formalised now, the main example being written risk assessments for just about every conceivable job onboard.

worked on some land based stuff many moons ago

 

[markc123]

I hear you. Probably best putting this comment in the pub though away from eyes that may take what you said as good advice.

Is this a do as I say comment and not what I do???

lol ... If people take what i said seriously, then to be honest, they deserve to feel the full force of electricity.

 

[applemac]

I got a bit slack over past two years but after xmas I got a half price lock off set for 20 quid, using it on every job now and feeling good about it, tick all the boxes safe and it looks professional

 

[pennychew]

I got a bit slack over past two years but after xmas I got a half price lock off set for 20 quid, using it on every job now and feeling good about it, tick all the boxes safe and it looks professional

How much was it reduced from? sounds like a good deal

 

[shanky887614]

Very rare. Either tape or keep the switch off tell the customer not to switch on or shout yolo and change whatever live ... once changed a CU live, stuck the meter tails in 2 massive chock blocks.

Some will read that and think joker, some will read that and think this nob is telling the truth ... all vote now!

nah dont use chock block, these are what you want.

couple of these will do you grand.

 

[Simonslimline]

nah dont use chock block, these are what you want.

couple of these will do you grand.

The image does not show!

 

[GB.Kayak]

nah dont use chock block, these are what you want.

couple of these will do you grand.

So long as they don't 'come off in your hand' ... they are better than IP2X!

 

[shanky887614]

So long as they don't 'come off in your hand' ... they are better than IP2X!

yup, cover in tape as well.

put them on, pull tails out and put in new board, job done.

 

[Guest77]

[h=2]Do you lock off?[/h]
I beg your pardon? Do you? does your wife know you are doing it? does she do it for you?= Post reported :biggrin:

 

[Guest77]

Hmm at least 11 liars here lol, so you go into a empty house to add one socket next to a socket on the ring, you lock off the breaker in the board even though it is a half hour job and the house completely empty? yeah right, I really believe you chuckle.

 

[GB.Kayak]

Do you lock off?


I beg your pardon? Do you? does your wife know you are doing it? does she do it for you?= Post reported :biggrin:

You talkin' to me ... ?

 

[Guest77]

You talkin' to me ... ?

No, your Scottish, I don't like the sweaty socks :49:

 

[GMES]

You talkin' to me ... ?

It's the Scottish Taxi driver

 

[Geordie Spark]

No, your Scottish, I don't like the sweaty socks :49:

Oi!! ...... Now't wrong with Jocks since they stopped sneaking over the border to steal our women & rape our cattle.

 

[pennychew]

It's the Scottish Taxi driver

Fare comment!

 

[GB.Kayak]

No, your Scottish, I don't like the sweaty socks :49:

'och aye the noo'

You are clearly very much mistaken! The young jock rabble on nearby housing estates, 'aye' voters, have less respect for me than Tony and Eng54 et al have for 5WWs! I am a too well spoken, due to teenage years in Henley upon Thames, expatriate Cornishmen. Who has as much respect for 'emmets' in his homeland, particularly second home owning ones, as the local jocks have for me a perceived 'Englishman'!

... but then I also believe in loving my enemies ...

 

[telectrix]

Fare comment!

Fair, before volz. sticks his oar in.

 

[ruston]

Me thinks the Geordie humour may have been referring to the fare lol.

 

[telectrix]

ah. didn't read the quote.

 

[Geordie Spark]

ah. didn't read the quote.

Since when did Scousers learn to read??

 

[ferg]

Since when did Scousers learn to read??

I find that offensive TBH.

Scousers at least need to be able to write otherwise they wouldn't be able to sign on.

 

[pennychew]

I find that offensive TBH.

Scousers at least need to be able to write otherwise they wouldn't be able to sign on.

Oooofffff!

 

[Geordie Spark]

I find that offensive TBH.

Scousers at least need to be able to write otherwise they wouldn't be able to sign on.

One can sign for all of them.

There are not many ways to sign "X " :laugh:

 

[HandySparks]

Well, I thought that was quite interesting. Thanks to those who have voted. The poll's still open.

I wonder whether the 11 members (so far, out of 53) who say that they always lock off when working on domestic installations, are primarily domestic or whether they're commercial/industrial sparks who occasionally work on domestic and carry over the habit from their mainstream work, where there is a greater likelihood of unwanted re-energisation of circuits.

 

[Geordie Spark]

Well, I thought that was quite interesting. Thanks to those who have voted. The poll's still open.

I wonder whether the 11 members (so far, out of 53) who say that they always lock off when working on domestic installations, are primarily domestic or whether they're commercial/industrial sparks who occasionally work on domestic and carry over the habit from their mainstream work, where there is a greater likelihood of unwanted re-energisation of circuits.

I wonder how many voted for the first thing that came into their heads just to throw the whole thing into disarray because some of us are like that!! :devil2:

 

[newtothis]

I'm doing my level 2 testing and inspection practical in may.
I hold my hands up it's a Electrical Trainee type course.
Please Mr Mod, can I go to trainees section - cos these bigger boys are teachin' me bad abbits LOL

 

[Simonslimline]

I'm doing my level 2 testing and inspection practical in may.
I hold my hands up it's a Electrical Trainee type course.
Please Mr Mod, can I go to trainees section - cos these bigger boys are teachin' me bad abbits LOL

There is a section at the bottom of the site about gaining access to the trainee section.

Perhaps try PM'ing one of the mods if you get stuck.

 

[ipf]

I'm doing my level 2 testing and inspection practical in may.
I hold my hands up it's a Electrical Trainee type course.
Please Mr Mod, can I go to trainees section - cos these bigger boys are teachin' me bad abbits LOL

Shut your eyes and hope, then.